Hamish Smyth

Hamish Smyth (HS) is a designer and husband to our pal Alex Daly. I am very encouraging of his long-form responses, as they convey the enthusiasm and curiosity we love here. I did have to edit a bit for length, otherwise you would had a #longread. Have a great week. -Colin (CJN) Tell us about yourself.I’m a graphic designer, if I had to name one thing. Currently I’m the co-founder of three companies: a publishing imprint, Standards Manual, a design studio, Order, and most recently, Standards, a tool for designers to build and publish online brand guidelines. Rewinding a bit, I was born in a small town in Australia, about an hour outside of Adelaide. Throughout high school I worked at McDonalds a few shifts a week. Looking back, I think that helped instill in me a strong work ethic (they have metal plaques that read “Time to Lean, Time to Clean.”) and also a love for process and order. McDonalds’ training is pretty famous. Pro tip: hire people that worked at a McDonalds! In high school, I had one of those teachers that changes the trajectory of your life. Mr. Scott Parker—who taught design and was the head of our “house”—he recognized I had some potential in design, and upon graduating, encouraged me to apply to study at Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology (RMIT), which was considered the best design program in the country at the time. After submitting a portfolio and an interview, RMIT accepted me (lucky, as I was an idiot and only applied to one university). In Australia, you go straight into your course of study, so it was hardcore design study from day one. I struggled at first, but got the design bug really bad, in a good way. I had some amazing teachers at RMIT, in particular David Cutter who deservingly gave me average grades in 1st year, Suzie Zezula, (an angel) who opened my eyes to the beauty of bookmaking, and Renato Gallina, the toughest critic you’ll ever meet (which is what you need before entering the design industry), but also a lovely person. As four years of university went by and a career approached, I dreamed of working in New York. But it always seemed completely out of reach—at that time, I had never even left Australia. My big break came in my last year of university when I entered a student portfolio competition at Ken Cato’s (then) design conference, agIdeas. The judges declared me the winner, and the prize was a 2-week internship at one of five design agencies across the world, and the choice was mine to make. One of the choices was Pentagram in New York—my dream was now seeming within reach. I didn’t know any of the details until I arrived, but I ended up on the team of the legendary designer and Pentagram partner Michael Beirut. Two weeks at Pentagram turned into a three month internship. Ater that a seat opened up, and having spent three months there, I was the easier option than hiring someone new, so I got a job. I worked for Michael for over 6 years, ending up as an associate partner. I worked on hundreds of projects under Michael’s direction, including designing a citywide wayfinding system for New York, Walk NYC, and rebranding Mastercard. The whole experience was beyond my wildest dreams, a lot of hard work, and a masterclass in the craft of design, presenting, and running a business. I’m eternally grateful for that opportunity. WITI Classifieds:We are experimenting with running some weekly classifieds in WITI. If you’re interested in running an ad, you can purchase one through this form. For our first few weeks, we are throwing in an extra week for free on any ad.A world of music in your inbox, one song at a time. Get Ecléctico.Do you want to improve your life by tapping into behavioral science insights? Listen to the award-winning Behavioral Grooves podcast today! Listen to Behavioral GroovesNudge, get customer insights with ease. Try NudgeDescribe your media diet. Chaos! I’m not a routine-type person so I don’t have a set of regular media that I consume. I envy those who seem to have a checklist of media they run through. Before Covid, my subway commute was a consistent time of media consumption that I looked forward to each day. I would slog my way through books (slow reader if I want to comprehend it deeply), The New Yorker, or articles mostly found on Twitter. These days I work mostly from home, or from The Malin in Soho, so my commute routine is more sporadic. I read a lot of articles. I’m not afraid to admit that I’m “under-read” serious book-wise (I read all of the Goosebumps books as a kid, if that counts). Generally I’ve made an attempt to broaden my sources, reading stuff across the political spectrum even if I don’t agree or like it. I’d say much of the mainstream news media I consume is from the WSJ, NYT, Financial Times, National Review, The Guardian, Al Jazeera, BBC, SBS (Australia), PBS, and then a whole lot of random outlets from Twitter. It seems hard to find a balance, filter out the bullshit, and still have time to work, and have a life outside of consuming media on our little screens. I have broad interests and will read things on any subject (or start, at least!). When I was younger and starting my career, I thought I needed to focus on reading almost exclusively about design, which is obviously a terrible idea in hindsight. Michael Bierut (Ed: see his MMD here) helped me shake that attitude. He would come to work talking about the latest episode of some popular TV show, book, podcast. One popular annual activity was a team review of the Met Gala outfits! It seems obvious, but to a country kid trying to be a serious New York professional, that kind of gave me the permission I needed to include more popular media in my diet, and chill out a bit.Opening up my sources and feeding my then dormant curiosity made me so much better at my job. I believe linking disparate ideas can help you solve problems in some of the most creative ways. Sometimes the most obscure reference can find its way from my subconscious, into the problem at hand, and create a breakthrough. When that happens, it’s thrilling, and it only makes me more curious.I love a good film—who doesn’t. But I’m picky, and usually won’t sit through an average one. When I was younger I didn’t appreciate the art of filmmaking, so it’s been fun to revisit old films, now that I appreciate the field more. Even though I had seen many of his mvoes, I recently watched all of Paul Thomas Anderson’s features in order, starting with the oldest (Hard Eight). That was a lot of fun. Popular opinion here, but There Will Be Blood is a masterpiece, and I’m jealous. I’m also jealous of Phantom Thread. How do you even make something like that? I secretly want to be a director.I love a good TV series too. Alex and I usually watch an episode of something with dinner. We’re currently re-watching Mad Men for the third time. I often prefer how TV can tell a longer story. Films sometimes seem too short to me—I’m like “No! Keep going!” But there’s also a beauty of condensing a story into ~2 hours, when it’s done well. My guilty pleasure TV show is Shark Tank, suggested to me by my business partner Jesse Reed. Also The Profit. They can both be so cringe, but I love business stuff! I remember seeing Curb Your Enthusiasm on SBS in Australia in 2000, and thought it was the strangest thing ever. Almost completely over my head. Now it’s one of my favorite shows. It’s funny how age and life experience influences how you interpret media. I enjoy listening to podcasts, but I don’t have one I listen to religiously. I can’t seem to do design or writing work and listen to podcasts at the same time, so long drives are my optimal podcast time. I once drove from New York to a printer in Minnesota, just to see some parts of the US I hadn’t seen before. On that trip, I listened to Dan Carlin’s Hardcore History “Blueprint for Armageddon” series. Holy shit. Each episode is like 3-4 hours. No notes from me.I also love music—where to even start? My dad played lots of Pink Floyd and Led Zeppelin around the house. Dad also was into Kenny G, who actually seems like a really nice guy. I was too young to buy a “first record” but the first tape I bought was Alanis Morissette’s Jagged Little Pill. I remember my mum and I were driving to the supermarket, and I put the tape in. It takes about 6 minutes to drive to the supermarket, which is about the time for the iconic opening track All I Really Want, and then enough time to hear the opening verse of You Oughta Know where it’s like “Is she perverted like me? Would she go down on you in a theater?” Chill stuff when you’re heading to the supermarket for eggs or whatever with your mum. I got pretty into 80s and 90s American rap in the late 90s, and early 00’s while most of my mates were into Metallica. That just never clicked for me, but respect. Recently I’ve been reading a lot of business and tech-focused articles and podcasts related to my work. In Depth from First Round has been a great resource. Every (a client of Order) is a newsletter I love. They also just launched a really cool word processor with AI assistance called LEX.If I’m being honest though, I spend a lot of my time now not consuming media. I feel sort of overloaded with it these days. Just reading what I’ve written above sounds like a full time job! These days I’ll often work in silence, and it feels like a luxury to just go for a walk and just…walk. The pressure to constantly consume media and be a “lifelong learner” is something I’ve felt before. More and more often these days, I’m trying to slow down a bit. Working on our businesses, spending time with my family, and trying to have a life outside of that doesn’t leave that much time. Some people seem to fit it all in, but I suspect a lot of us are lying. What’s the last great book you read?I recently learned about the Japanese term tsundoku: the habit of buying books and never reading them, or starting and abandoning books. I’m an expert at tsundoku.The last great book I read was Midnight in Chernobyl: The Untold Story of the World's Greatest Nuclear Disaster by Adam Higginbotham. Atomic physics is one of my favorite scientific fields, and this book masterfully intertwines the science, the people, the Soviet politics and culture, the minute-by-minute timeline of the disaster, the response, and the aftermath. I start a lot of books that I don’t finish, but this was one I couldn’t put down for long.    What are you reading now?I don’t have an impressive intellectual answer here. It’s likely I won’t finish it (and it’s not really a book that you read cover to cover), but my wife gave me Florida!, published by A24, for my birthday. She grew up in Miami and we spend a good amount of time there with family. It’s a thoroughly researched and dense book about the state, and I’m genuinely enjoying it, learning about parts of Florida I didn’t know existed, and earmarking some future trips. Lowbrow / Brilliant type of a book. What’s your reading strategy when you pick up a print copy of your favorite publication?I’ve never thought about having a strategy—is that a thing? For a long time after moving to the US, I read the New Yorker from cover to cover. When I arrived in New York, I was pretty green (I’d never even left Australia before coming here). At first I struggled to read and comprehend much of The New Yorker’s content, especially political stuff. But I pushed ahead, and tried to read everything. So many articles that sounded boring turned out to be fascinating. Over time it all started to click, and I couldn’t wait to read it on my commute. The New Yorker really helped me understand American culture. Of course I read other things, but that was my core for a while. After starting my companies, I’ve dropped off with the cover to cover approach. I still read a lot of articles online from The New Yorker, but I am deeply ashamed of the pile of unread issues now towering in my apartment. I’ll get to them one day, for sure.  Who should everyone be reading that they’re not?I’m not going to try and make up an answer here. I can’t think of anyone that I have read enough of to recommend! Recently I started Gateway, the science fiction classic by Frederik Pohl. I enjoy science fiction, on the hard side. The specific reason I’m reading Gateway is because my father-in-law recently matter-of-factly revealed Pohl is a family relative (!). There’s a great WNYC from 1977 with Pohl that sparked my interest in the book after learning about the connection. Second to directing films, I’d secretly love to write science-fiction novels. What is the best non-famous app you love on your phone? Timedash. It’s a little widget app for weather, time, and other things. It’s beautifully designed by TIN in Amsterdam, and one of the creators is my friend Vincent Meertens, who was an intern at Pentagram while I worked there (interning well below his pay-grade—he was already a world-class designer).  Plane or train?In America—planes, because we can’t seem to figure out trains (why?). The exception is perhaps the Acela Express, but honestly even then the bar is pathetically low! Respect to all the engineers and staff for keeping the trains going and all that. But have you visited the “dining car”? If you haven’t, don’t!In most other countries—trains,  when possible!What is one place everyone should visit? My answer is nostalgically biased, but my favorite place in the world is a ski town called Falls Creek in the Australian Alps. Every year, our family would drive over 12 hours from South Australia to the Victorian Alps, and spend a week skiing at Falls Creek. It’s a magical place—a ski-in, ski-out village with the most beautiful view of the alps, and with no cars in winter (when you arrive a Snow Trac takes you from the entrance to your lodging). Skiing in Australia is different. This is not Colorado or Switzerland in terms of size or elevation—far from it (Falls Creek’s max elevation is 1,780 m, or just 5,840 ft). But there’s something special about the snow gums (native eucalyptus trees that grow in eastern Australia), magpies, kookaburras, and the cheerful Aussie lifties. The sound of the birds in the morning is unforgettable (Aussies in America often lament about the general lack of birdsong). I’ll always remember going to Falls Creek as a kid with the fondest memories, and I know my parents shared that feeling, and worked really hard to make the holidays possible. Tell us the story of a rabbit hole you fell deep into. Last summer, I decided to get really into perfecting cheeseburgers (I know…but it was Covid times!). I got particularly fascinated with the history of the cheeseburger, and my time at McDonalds spurred this. I fell deep into a rabbit hole of trying to recreate the original McDonalds burgers and fries. Apparently their original fries from the 1950s were incredible, because they were fried in beef tallow. It created a perfectly crispy outside, and a fluffy inside. In 1966, the multimillionaire Phil Sokolof, following a heart-attack, started lobbying against cholesterol in fast food, eventually pressuring McDonalds to move from beef tallow to a vegetable oil mixture, which produces a terrible fry (passable if eaten fresh). But the fries were not my personal DIY obsession, as beef tallow seemed hard to come by, and I’ve spent too much time next to deep fryers as it is. Instead, I was obsessed with recreating the original burger, and spent many nights online researching this important subject. Finally, I came across a post on Reddit from someone who worked at one of the original McDonalds, and has, in great detail, produced a recipe book to recreate as best as we can with modern science, the original McDonalds menu and methods. I’ve lost the Edit post, but here is the PDF. Some of the ingredients and equipment are no longer available, but many of the techniques such as the fascinating Q-Time (resting time for the wrapped burger to steam and integrate its flavors) were still in practice when I worked there as a teenager. Well, it’s a great read if you’re into recipes and food history. Sadly, McDonalds has changed nearly all of their methods, under the guise of producing “fresher” food “to-order.”  In reality, the only thing cooked to order is toasting the bun, while the meat is pre-cooked and often sits for up to an hour in a warming tray. (Anyway, you can see how I can get down rabbit holes. This whole interview was full of them.) Even though I know it almost always disappoints, I still enjoy a McDonalds cheeseburger once or twice a year. Nostalgia is a hell of a drug. (HS) Thanks for reading,Noah (NRB) & Colin (CJN) & Hamish (HS) —Why is this interesting? is a daily email from Noah Brier & Colin Nagy (and friends!) about interesting things. 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